This isn’t intended to be a debate about should you use Shem angels in goetic Evocation. What I’d like to find out since I never read demons of magic or others like it, is the actual proper ( if there is such a thing) method of employing the Shem angels during goetic evocation. The actual procedure if anyone knows it.
I’ve been fiddling with my own methods but I’d like to compare.
What I know of trying it is that to begin with is a banishing ritual, and three ritual methods for evocation (petition, partial manifestation, full manifestation).
You use the evocation keys using the senses on your daily walks outside or using it in a visionary means.
You then call on the Shem angel and the three emissariy angels, the Shem angel must be called thrice, the psalm spoken thrice, and the emissary names each thrice spoken.
Then you do the evocation by calling on the spirit using the seals provided.
Yeah looks like I have to get the demons of magic book. Damn i hate GOM stuff mostly. I don’t know anything about the Shem angel emissaries and a Google search revealed nothing
Maybe @CosmicTofu @Verdo @ReyCuervo @uncleal know something
The old forum has that btw.
You have one ruling angel. All shem angels are “paired” (so to speak) with one of the Goetic. So you need to take the divine power in one way or another (call upon El, etc) and call upon the ruling angel and then the respective three ruling angels. After that you call upon the respective demon.
There are 72 groups of 5 spirits needed for this sort of work, all of them specific, none can be replaced. So the first step is to know what spirits compose each one of the 72 groups.
Yes I do know that and know who’s paired with who.
Ok I’m with you. Thanks for that. I’ve never used Shem in my goetic practice before now. I thought it was disrespectful. I see things differently now that I’m almost done with tree of life initiation.
I see now the angel can assist in getting more focused results and faster and with less collateral damage
Ok @ReyCuervo I’m hip to the game now.i got demons of Magick and Henry archers the Magick of angels and demons. I get it now. Thanks for putting me on the right direction.
I think the Angel Overlord route is cute. If someone needs minders, then use the minders.
Or use a hybrid approach with the self as tje centerpiece and the rest as supporting actors, regardless of composition.
Those that need more lessons have more freedom. Just my opinion, but something people will come across, in their own personal flavor and will be dressed with the trappings they need at that time.
I got nothing from Archer’s stuff, so I have no reason to buy into it. None of it worked for me. None. Other people have different experiences.
Hey, hope you got the answers you were looking for. I’ve got nothing more to add beyond what has already been stated. I’ve only ever called upon shem angels in the context on the Demons of Magick rituals.
Yeah man there are spirits that I feel need supervision and those that don’t.
A hybrid approach is probably the most sound I agree.
I just needed some format related material. I don’t intend on using his actual system either.
This is true also
Yes I did and thank you.
Some background. Pre-Shadownomicon. DarkestKnight recommended the Archer book. Not an offhand remark and one I took seriously. I was still scared (honestly) of working with spirits. I had heard Hecate’s call, but a fish out of water. What the fuck was Evocation?
I think different people need.different methods at different times. Different lessons at different times. Different paradigms (or parts thereof) at different times.
There isn’t a supreme rule to be had here. If it takes 3 angels to corral 1 demon… Or 1 demon can’t produce without 3 Angels…
Well, neither of these things are Universal, with enough experience. And ability (gained from experience)
Not all “Angels” feel or consist of the same, nor all “Demons”. And the rest that don’t fit into that? Say, like most of the rest of the entities in the non-Abrahamic world? Which was most of humanity’s time?
We want a source of order and comfort. These can be crucial when starting. Can be crucial throughout. Works until you move outside that paradigm.
If one looks these as energies, and not entities, which is also valid and can be done, this paradigm doesn’t really apply.
But some know it works. Numerous reasons why, all of which apply to the person, the means, the perspective, the ritual, and the outcome.
In the past 48 hours, I thanked an angel for helping me, including yesterday’s tipoff, hours from home, a “demon” for helping me with practices I wish to get better at, a psychopomp for sending an aid when visiting a graveyard, used my own calling and energy to call the dead to my own space today, the Lwa came to greet them and … etc…
I think those paradigms are great starting points. I think they can aid in helping newer people start with ritual.
I can’t speak to using these in advanced means. That doesn’t seem to apply to my entities or ritual types. But at some point, to more fully explore and understand some areas, like evocations, invocations, and possessions (at significant levels), then you have to let go of simplistic petitions, which is largely what the archers and the brands write of, right?
Get your material wants, but that isn’t the end goal at some point. In my case, I want this to be my last necessary incarnation. Very different perspective.
Dude you’re like light years ahead of me 
I definitely understand wanting this to be the last one. In the words of 50 cent “death gotta be easy cuz life is hard, it’ll leave you physically, and emotionally scarred.”
Yeah man life here in this world has brighter sides, I’ve seen some…but not really that often. I myself am tired.
Absolutely which is why fellowship with other magicians I think is so important.
Ref: The Goetia of Dr.Rudd (Skinner & Rankine)
Mm I tell you frankly magicians that don’t understand how to defend themselves from goetic spirits are delusional if they believe they are more than a source of food and offerings.
Demons respect strength. Weakness is something they capitalize on by nature. If you are trying to leverage good relationships as a way to do business with them it will only work until they realize you are toothless tiger.
You need to know how to Shem a Goetic spirit if they become a problem.
I don’t advocate this all time. If you’re heavy handed they will hate you.
Do it once in awhile as appropriate to show them how much fun it is to cross you the wrong way.
The Goetia of Dr.Rudd (Skinner & Rankine) is very much in agreement with this, and emphasises the point multiple times.